You can listen to Episode S3E6 right here!
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Hello, and welcome to the Third Age Design podcast sharing essential information on senior environments. I’m Lori Pinkerton Rolet. And this is the episode that Chichi and Dasher in my house had been waiting for. It’s pets in care, dementia and retirement living. In fact, we have so much to cover today that we have three guests in total so that we can view the topic from all sorts of different angles. So, from Ohio State University in Columbus, USA, I’ll be speaking with Dr. Jason Stull about the benefits and risks associated with pets in these environments. From Oregon in the US, we’ll speak with Scott Witt, founder of Select Home Care in Portland about their experiences, especially within the home care market. And our third guest today is Ian Cole, Manager of the Hallmark Care Home’s newest facility, Willington Park Manor, a home where residents can join the community with their pets. Now this is like a trip down memory lane for me, because I was born in Ohio, lived in Portland when I was growing up and moving to Wilmington in just a couple of weeks. So it’s just kind of fortuitous, I guess. Anyway, today’s mission… a review of ‘do’s’ and ‘dont’s’ of pets and senior living environments, what’s good about it, and what you can do to get your facility right for this opportunity. Arthur Schopenhauer said: “Talent hits a target that no one else can hit. Genius hits a target that no one else can see.” Now, I’m not claiming we’re geniuses here at ThirdAge.Design. But I can promise you we bring together the top talent and leaders in their respective fields to share with you essential information, which can positively impact senior living environments. And we back it up with relevant research on the links on our website. And if you haven’t done so already, just go to our website at ThirdAge.Design and hit the Join Us button. You’ll automatically receive this quarter’s ‘A TAD Extra’, exclusive information for our community members, you’re going to learn something new and possibly even challenging in each podcast episode. Plus, it’s entirely free. The Third Age Design podcast is supported by Innova Care Concepts- whose mission is to enhance quality of life through innovation. From hydrotherapy pools to furniture, you’ll find quality, aesthetics, and functionality in all unique Innova products. Innova Care Concepts, the leading edge of health care. Okay, let’s get started. Our first guest today is Dr. Jason Stoll, an Assistant Professor in Veterinary Medicine at The Ohio State University and University of Prince Edward Island, which is in Canada. Over the past 20 years, he’s taught and conducted research on the health risks and benefits of animals in various settings, including medical facilities and nursing homes. He holds a VMD from the University of Pennsylvania, a Master’s in Preventative Veterinary Medicine, from the University of California at Davis, and a PhD in Veterinary Infectious Disease from the University of Guelph. Am I pronouncing that correctly? Guelph, Guelph wealth not easy. He’s also a diplomat of the American College of Veterinary Preventative Medicine…so I can think of no one more qualified to get us started today. Thank you for joining us, Dr. Stull. I first read about your work in a Reuters article from back in 2018. about the benefits and risks of pets in nursing homes specifically. And I want to begin by asking how you got involved in this particular topic and area of study because it is quite a niche market. If you don’t mind me saying so?
Dr. Jason Stull
No, it really it really is so. So a little background on me. So you’ve obviously discussed my educational background. I was always very interested in public health as a young adult, and actually worked in public health in the US for a number of years. So I was a veterinarian working within human public health. So kind of serving as that facilitator between animal and people and health components. I did that for a number of years. I got a PhD in veterinary infectious diseases. And I was very interested in kind of the disease side of things. So the opportunity for different disease causing agents to move between animals and people. Certainly, this is nothing new. People having gone through and being gone through. We’re familiar with this concept. But it happens all the time. But there is oftentimes a lack of appreciation for that opportunity to happen. And so one of the areas that I get interested in I’m interested in with what are called zoonotic diseases, diseases that are transmitted from animals to people, is in particularly highly vulnerable individuals. And so these are the extremes of age. So very young individuals, elderly individuals, immunocompromised people, and pregnant people. And so the nursing home community really captures a critical group of these individuals, and so many of them are over the age of 65, some of them may be otherwise immunocompromised, and so as an area that I think deserved attention, I was quite interested in. Additionally, as I began to kind of pull back the layers a little bit, there’s not a lot of research that’s actually in this area. And it’s a little frustrating, because I think people really want to do what’s right. So the benefits and risks. But if we can’t really quantify those, it becomes very, very difficult to make good decisions. And so I began to kind of explore this a little bit, and I’ll be honest with you, I started out with the disease side, but very quickly, having actually been in many of these facilities, and seen the animals and the interactions that the that the individuals in these homes, whether these were people that were, you know, patients in the places or residents or the staff, I really began to truly appreciate the benefits of having some of these animals.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Well, let’s start with those positives, then. And then we can kind of pick apart what the what the challenges or negatives might be so that operators that are listening, designers and architects can, can have those considerations. So what did you see were the positives?
Dr. Jason Stull
Sure, and some of it is my own experiences, but also from the literature that’s out there. So I think the positive so there’s this concept called the human animal bond, right. And it’s this thing, people that have pets certainly can know exactly what I’m talking about. It’s this true connection that many people have with animals, and that can be cats, or dogs, or ferrets, or, or exotic animals or whatever it is that you connect with fish, for instance. So that connection has been shown to have dramatic improvements in health. So biological components with the way we function which reducing depression, increasing mobility, so a variety of direct and indirect effects that are beneficial to health. So the situation that I observed was a fairly simple one, it was an individual in one of these facilities. So we did as part of the research, we did some walkthroughs. And we’re talking to people and how they were managing for instances of cats that were on this particular group of rooms, and a woman starts coming by, and she had been diagnosed yet dementia. And there was automatically a lot of tension between her and some of the staff. And there was a lot of challenges with trying to communicate with her. And all of a sudden, there was a wagon that came by carrying rabbits. First of all, I’ve never seen rabbits not jump out of a wagon. But these were some really trained wet rabbits, the woman lit up, her complete demeanor changed her ability, and the staff’s ability to communicate with her dramatically changed. And I was sold at that point, just that one instance, to observe this transformation, or not only her own experience there, but also the ability and understanding for this type of connection. And that’s something that we heard in many of the surveys that we did, was this perceived improvement, this perceived enjoyment, perhaps not by all individuals, because not everyone’s an animal lover, but by many individuals. So it’s this concept many people as we know, in in the countries that we live in have pets, therefore, we’re creating kind of this home like environment, with many of these benefits, and there have been a variety of studies. So they also talk about social capital, right? So individuals that have a pet or an animal next to them are much more likely to interact with other people, because people can use that animal as kind of a launching board right? Begin. Yeah, exactly. Right. And so there can be these impacts that the hard part of this concept is they’re not always easy to measure. And so a lot of what we did was a lot about perceptions, but trying to actually measure and determine exactly what those benefits are, are harder and certainly there’s you know, benefits for cardiovascular disease and all these kind of things. But the human animal bond piece is much, much more difficult. So anyway, that’s those are, I think, the benefits that we see. And I think those individuals that have had animals either in their lives or in their work replays can appreciate some of those.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
I mean, I can just imagine, I’m not in a position where I’m needing to be in a care facility. But I would really have difficulty going without Chichi and Dasher, you know, I’m not going without my pets, so I can see that there’s, you know, it becomes part of your family, we’re talking about this human, you know, pet connection, it’s part of my family, why would I relocate my family without the family members? Becomes a bit of an issue. Now, I have cats, I happen to know you have a dog. Are there any kinds of animals that from a veterinary standpoint, you would recommend against keeping in a care for dementia facilities specifically?
Dr. Jason Stull
There are and so I think part. So there’s clear benefits, but it’s really important, anyone who has a facility in which they’re involving animals or is thinking about it, that you really educate yourself on all aspects of this, because what I frequently see is this jumping in these benefits, but then not taking necessarily all the time. And again, research isn’t always isn’t always as clear, but there’s some resources out there that will comment on later, that can help you to develop a programme that’s going to maximise benefits, reduce some of the risks. So what are the risks? There are a couple of key risks as I see them. So one are kind of bites and scratches, simple physical issues. And so obviously, that comes down to the temperament of the animal themselves. Number two, is infectious disease risks. So in other words, the ability for an animal to transmit a bacteria, a virus or a parasite to a person. Now, we all know that so there’s hundreds of diseases that can be transmitted from companion animals from dogs, cats, and you know, other exotic animals to people. There are a couple of key groups of animals, which are more likely to potentially harbour some of these have those in their bodies, and then to transmit them to people. And these are some of the groups that I get more concerned about. So number one was talking about species. So reptiles and amphibians, here, we’re talking about turtles, snakes, those types of animals, and I’ve been in facilities where I’ve seen those, and they are high risk for transmitting diseases like salmonella, so you gotta be really careful. Small rodents, so mice, rats, these, these guys are…Gerbils… can be a little bit. So some of these, some of these are not quite as bad. There’s lots of grey areas, we want to be a little bit more cautious about some of the small rodents, actually, rabbits are not technically, rodents, and rabbits are probably a bit safer from some of these other animals. Now, even dogs and cats, so young dogs and cats, and generally I’m saying under the age of six months, so these animals are much more likely to be carrying various bacteria, etc, in their systems, much more likely to shed that and there have actually been outbreaks related to for instance, a brand new puppy brought into a facility. It had a bacteria called campylobacter, which is pretty common in a lot of these guys. But it shed it to many of the people there and got and caused a lot of illness in the facility. And just remember, although most of these situations don’t necessarily result in extreme health issues, although they can in the people, you don’t want this as part of your programme, right? It’s a negative, negative strike against you. And if people aren’t already happy with the concept, this is just more movement toward it. So those are some of the key groups, exotic animals, so animals that these are like chinchillas groups that we just don’t really know a lot about. So and then the final group are going to be farm animals. You say farm animals who brings…I’ve seen it all. So generally, especially young, young animals, so for instance, baby chicks, baby ducklings,
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
I was just going to ask about birds.
Dr. Jason Stull
Yeah, so the real young ones, you know, if it’s in an enclosure, like an aviary, generally those risks are a lot less, it’s when we start to have either direct contact, connect contact with touching those animals or touching areas in which those animals have been. So as an example, I was at one facility and they were very excited about the fact that they just had a turtle race the day before, and so that turtles walking across their floors. Not really a great decision in terms of the types of interactions that are having turtles are shedding salmonella. Salmonella is a really nasty disease and people that are immunocompromised or elderly we’ve got it on our floor. Now we’ve got to clean it up. So really taking some steps into thinking about what’s the right animal for my intended use or involvement of that animal and really matching
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
May I just ask, in terms of just going back to cats for a second. common disease, toxoplasmosis, which affects women can affect women when they’re giving birth, for example, or when they’re pregnant. Does a disease like that have any potential impact that you’re aware of for older people as well, is that something that one might do before bringing pets in is any sort of a medical scan for any bacterial infections or viruses that they might carry?
Dr. Jason Stull
So, perfect segue… So a lot of this is not only the types of animals, but also we want to protect those animals and, and that means having healthy animals. And so some of that is ensuring the pets themselves are healthy. So preventative care, regular veterinary care. And so we’re bringing that animal, especially if it’s going to be a resident, it’s going to live in the facility, having it evaluated by a veterinarian to ensure it’s healthy. Now, I want to just make a comment about the toxoplasma concept. So this is one of those areas…So there’s certain types of things we’re going to look for. So generally, those that have pets may be familiar, a lot of times were looking veterinarians will do a screen of their feces to look for different types of parasites. And that’s generally there’s dewormers that we put them on, because many of those things can travel to other animals or travel to people. However, the only issue with toxo which, which is an interesting one is that, and is I think, is representative of this, this whole topic is that there’s a lot of misinformation. So we have to be very cautious to ensure that what we’re doing is truly in the best interest of the animals and the people. So when we screen animals and looking for something, we have to recognise that that’s at one point in time. And it may not be for instance, representative of that animal. So there’s certain things we want to screen for, like some of parasites. Toxoplasma in cats, is actually probably not the most common way that most people get infected with toxoplasma it’s actually undercooked meat. So yeah, So that’s probably even more important. Now, I will say cats, yes can do shed if they’re infected, this this type of parasite, but it’s in their poop. And it doesn’t become infectious for generally at least two days after it’s come into their poop. So a lot of this and mitigating these risks is around appropriate husbandry or care, right. So frequently cleaning that litter box, key, we clean it every day, we’ve dramatically reduced toxoplasma. If that cat stays indoors, ideally, because of the types of things, it’s not going to get infected with toxoplasma, right, and we’re not feeding it raw foods. So really, now we’ve dramatically impacted and reduce these risks. So and again, when we talked about, I just got to say it, we’re talking about cleaning up the poop. This is not somebody’s job, who is immunocompromised over the age of 65. Ideally, this is somebody who’s a staff member who’s younger, who’s healthy and is doing those types of partners … …part of what they’re doing. Key. You mentioned, research that you were going, is there any specific research that you can make us aware of that we can put with the podcast research page for more information on some of these topics? Absolutely. So there’s a handful of papers, and I’m going to mention a couple of them. There should be more. It’s frustrating. And so one of the points I think that’s frustrating is, is that also when we talk about kind of protecting that pet, and we’ve talked a little bit about, you know, kind of making sure that pets healthy, but also it’s protecting that pet from the amount of activity it has, because it’s pretty exhausting, right? We’re all tired, we have to go from person to person to person is probably tiring for a pet whose kind of job it is, in many cases to go from person to person to person. So knowing what’s that right amount hasn’t really been defined. But so that’s just something to keep in mind. So a couple of things I want to mention. There’s been a relatively recent kind of evaluation of what I’m going to call best practices for animals. And it’s predominantly been in medical care facilities. And so that’s a paper by Murthy. And I’m going to send you the link to that. The second one is a paper that that I wrote not too long ago in a specific to nursing homes. And so we did some work in the United States. And this was related to the to the article that you had read about and it was talking about the work that we had done. That itself may be useful, but there’s also a number of components within it and in the that we cite and mention that may be of interest to people. One of those and I’ll give you also we can include that with these resources is an actual model policy. So it’s a Word document. And it actually has kind of key concepts. Alright, so who’s going to take care depends on who’s going to do A, B, and C. So it helps you to break it down. So you don’t have to start from scratch, you’ve got something that you can begin to create, and to bring you up to speed and or if you already have a document, then you see how well it aligns. And the final thing, the final thing I’m going to mention, and so this will not be new, probably to many individuals that are already involved in this concept of infection control within a facility. But there’s a group and international group, it’s called Weber trainings I’ve done and I’ll send you the link to that I’ve done a number of talks for this particular training group, they are open access after a year, right. So sorry, I wish it was if you want to pay for it, it’s also like $30, or something, it’s not super expensive. So I’ve done a number of these over the years, if you actually just search for my name, s- t- u- l-l, you’ll come up with a number of talks on this topic, one that’s probably most useful I did last fall. So if you want to wait until it becomes open access sometime, I think it was in September of this upcoming year, it will be open access to you. Or you can pay the nominal fee to get it. But these are some of the things that are out there that will help you direct you in ensuring that you’re making the best choices for you’re…
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
…and coming up with a policy and in terms of the environment. And let’s use care again as the as the envelope. You mentioned having turtles crawling across the floor, you know, they may be shedding salmonella, for example. We’re often using vinyl floor coverings for an infection control standpoint, but sometimes we’ll also use impervious back carpets in the design work within these facilities. With pets do you have… and these impervious back carpets can also be bleach cleanable, for example. But then again, you might not want your cat or dog or turtle. Let’s say we’re not having turtles, but any of the pets that you are having, you may not want them walking across something that has recently been bleached, for example. So do you have any guidelines? And you may not. But do you have any guidelines for us as to surfaces that might be recommended for in a facility for pets?
Dr. Jason Stull
Yeah, so there’s a couple of things to think about too. And one of those also is one that we haven’t really talked too much about, which is also allergies. So you just need to be very open to the fact that one, not everyone’s going to like animals, and we need to be aware of that. Some people are afraid of animals. And so thinking about the types of species and making sure that we have those conversations before we bring an animal right in. And then the third also are some people have allergies. And so ensuring that the types of animals that we’re bringing in the types of surfaces where we’re bringing them are amenable to cleaning and disinfection. And so again, if it’s not an animal that, for instance, maybe lives in the facility, then we can be very careful on where we take that animal in the facility. So if there’s going to be a time where it’s going to be, you know, opportunities for people to interact with the pet, then we can choose a location, which is easy to clean and disinfect. So a lot of it comes down to planning, in terms of in terms of, you know, concerns about animals. So some of the animals vary a little bit in terms of their how vulnerable they might be, for instance, to surface cleaners and things like that. . So for instance, birds are generally very sensitive to different types of disinfectants, we have to be a little cautious about that some of the reptiles might again, probably not a great choice, but we’ll have we’ll have skin that allows for those things to come. And so as long as we’re, we’ve if we’re cleaning and disinfecting and ideally we’ve washed away any Surface Disinfectant at the very end after it’s had an opportunity for that contact time to kill the pathogens, we’re generally fine for any of these animals. And so part of those that’s information, though, is readily available from a veterinarian. So that is an area that I would highly encourage every group should have a veterinarian who’s responsible for, you know, giving input on the safety and wellness of those pets and that that they can do. That’s a very well versed in that. This other piece about this possible transmission of diseases from pets to people is less in the wheelhouse of the average vet.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Right. Okay, but could be in the wheelhouse of the research that people can look further into. Absolutely. Final thing is more of a just a point. Can we agree between us that arachnids are right out?!
Dr. Jason Stull
Yeah, so we knew we do need to be careful about some of those other animals and really being aware of I think at the end of the day, if you want to say to me, I want to bring X type of animal in. I’m going to say why? And so if we have a protocol and a process by which these decisions are at least discussed, it will stop kind of, hey, by the way, I’m just gonna have a good friend who’s got a bunch of spiders he’s gonna bring in or whatever it is, right? Like, we just need to make sure that we’re really maximising the benefit of these animals because there are also and we’ve all been talking a lot about disease transfer from animals to people. Now, I’m not sure many people know this, but people can transmit diseases to animals. COVID is a perfect example. So although not very common, we absolutely know many cats. Many dogs and many other animals have been infected with COVID from their people. And there’s other diseases as well. MRSA methicillin resistant staph aureus, big problem in a lot of healthcare facilities that can absolutely cause infections in pets. So being aware of this back and forth will help us determine what’s the best in benefits.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
which goes back to the point that you had previously made about the importance of having a vet for your facility that you can run these things by and discussing and get direct feedback to your questions. Thank you so much, you were actually the perfect guest to discuss this. As you said, having experience looking from both directions, people to pets and pets to people is a very niche thing, but clearly important, very important if we are going to go down this route to the benefits of having pets in care and dementia facilities. Thank you so much.
Dr. Jason Stull
Truly a pleasure. Thanks for having me.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
And, you’ll find direct links to some of the research we’ve been discussing on the podcast page for this episode at ThirdAge.Design. And we’re continuing the discussion now with Scott Witt, Founder and Managing Partner of Select Homecare, which he founded in 2009. In Portland, Oregon, a place that I used to live. His passion for serving seniors relates back to having multiple family members in health care. And following his service in the first Gulf War, he completed a bachelor’s degree in mechanical engineering, adding on work in computing, before embarking on his work with Select Home Care who over the years have cared for Holocaust survivors, decorated World War II veterans, and even a pilot from the Tuskegee Airmen. Scott, thank you so much for joining me on the Third Age Design podcast.
Scott Witt
You’re welcome. Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Now, we appreciate having you. And I wanted to ask specifically, I mean, I just briefly touched on the introduction as to the fact that you had family members that were working in the care industry, but what have you noticed in the home care market in relation to keeping pets? Has this been an issue that’s come up with the clients of your group?
Scott Witt
Well, yes, our clients so I know your this whole discussion is pets in care, and definitely more pet focused. We have. So we’d like you said 2009. So I started about 15 years ago. And one thing we’ve noticed is that our clients that have pets, they love those pets. They don’t want to give them up. And it’s a great thing because they keep them calm and stress. You know, they have all these benefits we’ll probably talk about, but we’re essentially a homecare agency walking into unknown situation. We do ask, Do you have any pets in the home this and that before we meet people and you don’t always get a straight answer, or, you know, they often forget that they have cats and one of our folks that does the intakes is highly allergic to cats and her throat’s almost closed up a few times. And she’s got an epi pen. It’s like oh, you’re sure you don’t have a cat? Well, yeah, but he stays in the bedroom the whole time. We didn’t think he’d bother you. Yeah. So yeah, we deal with it and we know that they essentially want to keep the pets and we our mission is just to make that safe and doable.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
So how do you if you excuse the pun,’ vet’ the pets, before you go in? I mean, do you are there particular questions that you ask about the demeanor of the pets, etc., or the age of the pet etc?
Well, we are a little more person-focused first. So a lot of our discussions on our intake calls are more on the lines of the conditions of what the other person is dealing with do they have any dementia and you know, mobility issues and things like that. And depending on who they are, a lot of times we’re talking to a family member as well. So we’re trying to gauge all of that in addition to are there pets in the home. And then once we know that will generally it’s normally just going to be a cat, a dog, a bird. We don’t hit too many exotic things. And we don’t necessarily, we probably should ask a little more detail on that. But generally, we figure of pets in there with an 85 year old, they’re probably it’s probably not Cujo, that’s going to come after us and take us down at the door. But so we’ve been lucky, I guess, in that in that manner. Really, just aside from what type of pet they have, we haven’t gone too much beyond that. We just get there and kind of see what we have once we walk through the door.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Right? And you mentioned safety a moment ago. And are there ever issues as people continue to age and you’re caring for them Select Home Care is helping to look after and support them? Are there any issues with people suddenly becoming less stable on their feet and the pet becomes potentially a problem? Have you ever had to have conversations around safeguarding the homeowner as they age with a pet?
Scott Witt
Yeah, we have had that. And we’ve had situations where we’ll do an assessment of the home and point out all the obvious things that a lot of folks need to do. Especially when their eyesight may be degenerating, then they have mobility and balance issues. And so all those stability concerns come in. And fall risk is really our number one of our number one concerns that we look out for. And you can remove the throw rugs and put rails and everything else. But if you have a pet, that’s a nice slow moving pet that doesn’t move. And your client can’t see that, that becomes an issue where they’re stepping and hitting and tripping over the over the pet. That’s the number one
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
…or whether or not contrasted where the dog is the same colour as the carpet.
Scott Witt
Yeah, well, yeah. And then they have eyesight issues and perception issues anyway, they couldn’t even see the dog. So sometimes that’s, that can be a real issue. Yeah, so what but we haven’t really had to go so far as to say, you know, you need to get rid of this pet we would more try to deal with how can we actually make this safe for you for the pet. So that you can both still live, you can still love that little dog every day, but not trip over it and fall and break a hip and end up in rehab and write the whole thing?
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
And do you do a lot you mentioned, you know, grab rails and things do a lot with you know, why don’t we make the dog bowl bright red, you know, so you don’t trip over it? Or does it get to that level of detail? Or is it just down to the individual care in that particular instance?
Scott Witt
It’s pretty much down to the individual person, I think we’re we will do a lot of little recommendations that I’ve never really even thought of in this sense, but where to place and normally they kind of have it set up. They’ve got the bowls and things in certain spots that they’re familiar with. And generally those worked out pretty well. So they’re not tripping over that or running into that. Yeah, so I guess that that generally works out we I haven’t had to see too many things that we’ve done purely because there’s a pet in the home there. I guess they’re good things to do. Whether there is or is not a pet now as far as those all those mobility devices and railings and things like that, right. But it sure helps, you know, and a lot of times they’re using a four wheel or a front wheel walker. And that’s that is kind of like a that’ll, that’ll make the dog move, you know, because they the dog sees the walker come in and they kind of get out of the way but…
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
I haven’t thought about that. But that’s obviously that’s a very good point. Yeah, it’s it all it needs then is the sound of a Hoover and you’ve got you’ve got everything. And do you make sure people generally have an alternative carer? Should their health require it? For example, somebody has a dog and they’re really unsteady on their feet. You know, do you recommend they have an alternative carer? Would your staff sort that side of things out and take a dog for a walk as part of their part of what they’re doing during a visit?
Scott Witt
Yeah, well, yeah, a couple of parts to that I yeah, for sure we do that we do a lot of hearing for pets. And matter of fact, we had one resident in a long term care setting and an independent living, that had a cat, she just loved this cat. And we actually did no care for the person, but we came in to feed the cat water, empty the litter box at once a day, and the little fellow just passed away a few weeks ago. But we did that for about three years. Daily going into take care of the pet. And just as a side note, that’s expensive. Because we’re not really set up to do one hour or you know, half-hour checks. Most agencies are, you know, three or four hours minimum. So we had kind of this elevated short shift rate to come in and do that really well. We’re happy to do it, because we love to care for animals. Normally, how it works is where they’re caring for the person. And we also take care of the pet. As a side, as a side note, you know, we make sure everything’s good, we’ll take them for walks, get them outside. And then as far as the ongoing care or the another carer. Normally, when we set up care, we have the client, and generally a family member of son or a daughter that’s overseeing the care, maybe they’re the power of attorney or the healthcare power of attorney. There generally, we’re not too worried about what our client passes away, what’s going to happen, because we know if they have family around, right, take care of that. So it’s not I do know, not to go on too many tangents. But we’ve had other residents that have had birds, like the parrots and things that live forever, it seems like they and the clients were telling us that they when we first when I first started doing this many years ago, they said, Oh, we have a will are the birds in the will. And I never thought of that before. I said, Wow, the birds in the will? They said oh, yeah, because he’s, he’s only 20 years old. And I’m, I’m 87. So he’s going to outlive me, you know, he’s going to be here for another 40 years or 50 years. So I thought, boy, that’s quite a you’re taking on quite a project there when you decide to get a parrot or, you know, I’m not enough. I’m using the right or toucan or whatever the…
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Mina bird or whatever. Yeah, yeah, very interesting. So the, the longevity of the pet is something we haven’t discussed thus far. But that’s a very interesting aspect for people to think about. And just to summarise, in terms of home care, the main concern and interaction would be that which relates to safety in the environment with the pet and the resident and the individual care who’s going there, being able to assess or make suggestions to make that environment as safe as possible with those parameters. Is that correct?
Scott Witt
Yes. Yeah, definitely.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
That’s so lovely. And I had never thought about the length of pets. lives, but definitely we need to stay away from giant tortoises. I think they live 120 years or something. Scott, thank you very, very much.
Scott Witt
Yes, no, you’re welcome. I appreciate it.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
There’s more research and information on Select Home Care on the podcast page for this episode at ThirdAge.Design. Okay, we’ve now talked and if you’ll excuse the pun, we’re going to ‘tail’ today’s topic on pets and senior environments with some key ‘do’s’ and ‘dont’s’ from a care operator in the United Kingdom. Ian Cole is the General Manager for Hallmark Care Home’s newest and very elegant facility, Willington Park Manor. With 15 years of experience in Adult Social Care, he’s achieved an outstanding rating for an acquired brain injuries home and has dedicated nearly 10 years to the multi-award winning Hallmark Care Homes. Ian, thank you so much for joining me on the podcast.
Ian Cole
You’re welcome.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
I want to begin by asking if you’ve ever previously been involved in homes which allowed pets?
Ian Cole
Yes, I mean, prior to Hallmark, we had the policy where pets were allowed, but it was a lot less a scale in those days of residents bringing their own pets in. We was more reliant in the old days of, of the care team or the management team, bringing their pets in, and then sort of taking them home, or the pets at therapy, the pet pals coming in and replacing the residents own pets. Again, we bought in lots of different very, very species in that, but it was it was more controlled where the residents did have the ability to do so. But it wasn’t something that was looked upon as saying it’s just something that we’ve, we’ve really worked hard on it a Hallmark because it’s just a big part with the residents well being put to the front of their care, and ensuring that they got the normal day to day life within a care home.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
It’s their home.
Ian Cole
Exactly,exactly. So. So yeah, it was present. It’s a lot more evident these days.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
And did you have any concerns the first time you came across this any specific concerns about pets in these sorts of facilities? And if so, what were your concerns?
Ian Cole
I suppose the concerns was there wasn’t introducing a risk to the resident by, you know, getting under their feet, or trip hazards or things like that. And also for the other residents that were around people that had pets that there was no, they weren’t scared of them, or phobias, or allergies. I mean, that’s obviously the other thing. So it’s a much bigger picture that you had to look at. And obviously you still do these days, but it’s in a much more controlled and rigorous programme to ensure that it’s improving everybody’s wellbeing.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
And not just the people that that have the pets. Just going back to what you just mentioned about allergic reactions. I know I was working on a care home with a care home group in the UK. And one of their sites, they had this big, long haired fluffy white cat walking around. But of course, that was fine with the residents they had then. But how do you assure that anybody moving in isn’t allergic to cats. So if you had a, if you had cats, as an example, in a home, do you have to literally quote unquote, vet people who are allergic to cats to say you don’t want to move here?
Ian Cole
Absolutely. And that’s just the process, taking it forward. And again, also for the team that are working or, or visitors of a residence, you know, you’ve got to make everybody aware of what is in the home. So anybody who has that ability to then be able to communicate back with us, that is an issue for them. So it’s been open and transparent with what the home is doing. And as you say, quite rightly, going forward and making sure that you maintain that over the longer term.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Right. And you mentioned earlier, you had different species of pets, what pets have you been involved with in in care environments.
Ian Cole
Obviously, the main ones are cats and dogs, but I’ve had buggies goes I’ve had one resident that had a rabbit, and obviously fish. And we had one resident in the past that actually had a lizard, but it was only for a short term. So when while she was getting that rehouse So, again, it’s having that, that open policy, that there isn’t any real restrictions, as long as it’s manageable for everybody to be able to do so, you know, all the pets that come into the home ever have a care plan. The pets have a care plan? Absolutely, absolutely. That’s followed by the risk assessment. But it’s not only the well being of everybody that seems to have been essentially the well being of the pet. Now if you’re moving some say a cat that used to be going out and pre roaming and suddenly the residents moving in onto the first floor, that’s not something that is the cat is going to be able to do freely. So you’ve actually got a look at the well being of the animal so that the animal is not suffering in any way as well. So you know, it’s just the restrictions and having an open mind on ensuring whatever type of animal the person wants to bring in. That we’re ensuring that it’s everybody including the pets,
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Right. And the pets. Well, the people let’s go back to the people first. The people their health may not be stable all the time. So what sort of protocols do you have to put in place, if a resident becomes unable to, let’s say, walk their dog?
Ian Cole
Again, it’s having a good robust system in place at the beginning. You’re working with the residents, their family, their friends, and the care team and the volunteers and the lifestyles team within the home. So that for those periods when the resident isn’t able to fully look after the pet, that there is a backup plan in place to ensure once again that the pet is not suffering in any way. And I mean, in all our homes, the care team get absolutely involved in the pet care as well. And they love dealing with dogs for a walk or, or, you know, taking the route or whatever it is, is, is that how am approached to ensure that everybody is getting what they need, at the right time.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
And what changes do you think or modifications might be necessary for a care home that’s considering or an operator that’s considering bringing pets in, in the future in terms of finishes? Does this mean you must have vinyl floors everywhere? For example? Does it mean that any dog bowl are have to be colour contrasted? Are pets allowed in lounges? I mean, what sort of practical applications are there for the interior environment itself?
Ian Cole
I mean, firstly, I mean, one thing that we are really, really fortunate with within Hallmark is, all our bedrooms are much larger than what we traditionally call care, home bedrooms. A lot of lot of the bedrooms have lounges, but also the communal spaces that’s available within the home is really good. So you’ve got all those extra areas to be able to ensure that the pet has got freedom to move around. But once you’re in the bedroom, we wouldn’t really want to change things because it’s still the residents home, you wouldn’t want to change the flooring, you know, to vinyl for the pet because the resident may prefer carpet on there. So it’s managing every need on an individual basis. Again, not introducing risks to the residents. So you can’t have the bowls the same colour as the carpet. Because if the if the resident has got any kind of impairment on sight, again, that’s introducing the trip. So every separate instance has to be risk assessed individually for what is needed for that, for that pet for that room.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Now, your website, the Hallmark Care Home website in general, lists health benefits of having pets, including improved mood, reduce depression, lower blood pressure, encouraging exercise, reducing and preventing stress, and even help to prevent disease. Have you personally observed any of these benefits when you’ve seen people reacting? Or have you seen the behaviour or the demeanor of people change in response to pets in the home?
Ian Cole
Very much. So it’s, it’s, again, it’s bringing normality into the resident while they’re within the care home. So all the things that we do and take for granted when we’ve got our pets or even, as you say, just getting that little bit of exercise, if you’ve got a dog and walking, sometimes people could just be encouraged to be able to sit in their chair, because they haven’t got a purpose to go and do anything, you know, we will always encourage residents, but if they’re bringing their own pets in, that’s their self motivation to ensure that they’re doing these things. And I think one of the other big benefits that people sometimes forget, normally when residents are entering the home, for the first time is when they would be bringing their pets with them. So and that’s a big a big stress levels for the new residents coming into a care home. So if they’ve got their pet with them, again, it’s their home. They’re transferring from one house to another. They’ve got their pets with them as a reassurance that everything is going to be as normal. So it’s just ensuring that it’s a normal day to day living. And that’s what pets bring it. We all have our own pets at home. And we do take it as a standard that we haven’t so why can’t people in care homes have that?
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Yes. And do you have a vet that that works with the home and the pets in it or do people use their own individual vets?
Ian Cole
We would normally again encourage people to have their own vet in place or preferred supplier so that we know who to contact. But obviously, there’s always events that happen that no one’s planning for. And within Brighton and in Eastbourne, we’re very fortunate that there are lots of different veterinary surgeons surgeries around the homes. So we’ve got the option in case of emergency to be able to contact but again, it’s that that that resident’s choice on what vets are using, because they may have used them for years, working with the families what’s best it is that that relationship centred care, that is also being transmitted over to the pets as well. Because we need to get everybody involved, we need the resident, the family, the friends, as well as the care team.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
If you have a care plan for the pets, I think that’s amazing.
Ian Cole
It’s important, because you just got to, you got to know that, you know, previous conditions, even with the with the packs what they’ve had in the past, but actually the everything that needs to be done is being maintained. And again, everybody’s then got a clear idea of the united as a dog, it might just be walked three times today. I was might like one longer walk. So again, the care team have got that, that record on two hands of what actually the pet requires, right?
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
And have you ever had the unfortunate situation where you had to ask a resident to remove a pet?
Ian Cole
Not so not in my time to be honest. I mean,
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
You’ve obviously done the vetting upfront properly, then yeah.
Ian Cole
And that’s the thing, it’s the preparation paperwork that needs to be done, if the resident can no longer care for the pack themselves that you know, the family prepared to take over or the care team. I mean, most times the care team would always step over, obviously, is that the resident does pass. That’s a conversation that we would have had at the beginning, that what the family would like to do in and in some cases, we’ve actually had where a resident has passed and the care team have made it to the homes pet, and it stayed within the home and other people have looked after it. So yeah, we’re in a caring profession, in its impacts, again, are a big part of our life. And that care should just transmit naturally to pets as well.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
That’s very, very inspirational. So we’ve mentioned just a couple of a couple of risks, potential trip hazards, etc, potential of people are having allergic reactions. But overall, my final question is, in do the benefits outweigh any risks?
Ian Cole
Absolutely. I mean, the risks have always got to be managed, but the benefits are huge. That it’s as simple as that, you know, the benefits for everybody. But to actually you have a resident that sitting there happy contented with their pet on their lap or by their side, that smile that transmits makes our job worthwhile, because that’s what they’re there for, to make the Residence Life as comfortable as we can. And that’s what pets do.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
Thank you. That’s, that’s really very, very helpful and quite inspiring. Thank you so much for your time Ian
Ian Cole
You’re more than welcome. Thank you very much.
Lori Pinkerton-Rolet
You’ll find lots and lots of research this month for this episode, including a short video from Japan, in English, about a very special end of life dog named Bunpuku. If you can get through this without being moved or even shedding a tear, you’re a stronger person than I am. Time for our quick review of the TAT International Events Calendar. homecare con is booked into the lovely Omni Orlando Resort in Florida, USA from the 31st of July to the 3rd of August. The National Exhibition Centre in Birmingham, England is the site of The Care Show on October 11 and 12th. And I’ll be speaking and hope to see you there if you’re in the UK. The 33rd Alzheimer Europe Conference will take place in Helsinki, Finland from October 16 to the 18th. And as always, you’ll find further details and listing on our Events page at ThirdAge.Design. And let us know if you’ve got an event you’d like to see listed there. Thank you to all three of today’s special guests, Dr. Jason Stoll, Scott Witt, and Ian Cole. To our producer Mike Scales, to Valerie Adler of The Right Website, to Peter Thorne, who composed our theme music and is playing the piano with Mary Blanchard on flute. And, to our sponsor Innova Care Concepts…the leading edge of health care. And finally, to you. Thanks for being part of a community who believes we can improve senior environments together. I’m Lori Pinkerton-Rolet and I do hope you’ll join me for the next one!